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Post by captainapache on Apr 2, 2011 10:38:50 GMT -5
Hello all, I' ve just received my copy of the rules - I was so excited about getting this game, there is something about it that has really captured my imagination ;D Anyway, I'm desperate to get a game going but I'm looking through the rules and have come across a couple of things that have me asking questions....... 1.) Sprinting - say a figure has 3AP, can he move, then let off a shot (RoF permitting) then with his remaining 1AP launch into a 9" sprint? The rules state that a model has to expend all it's AP to sprint but does this mean ALL or all the remaining AP? 2.) Creating a crew. Phew....this has got me really confused.It's the part of the game that really attracted me to it in the first place but I can't seem to get my head around it. At first I though I had it right - say I have a veteran crew of bounty hunters - 2 Vets, and 2 Regs. The way I understood the rules I could upgrade one of my Regs to a Vet by losing One of the Reg units. Then I looked at the two man crew and couldn't figure how to get up to Elite status whithout losing one of my units, then I got even more bamboozled when it says I can have more than two in a two man crew...how? Scanning this excellent forum I came across a couple of other posts that had similar problems but unfortunately I still don't understand whats going on, even though there was a pretty in depth answer. Maybe I'm getting old and the brain is failing?? I think I need it explained in very simple, almost childlike terms!!! Hahahaha I'm now extra confused because it seems that you can upgrade for free, but I can't see this in the rules. Also, just how many slots are there? For instance, a two man crew - how many slots are there to fill? Can someone walk me through this, It's giving me a headache! Again, sorry if it's obvious and I'm failing to get it. Thank you.
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Post by mobo on Apr 2, 2011 11:23:13 GMT -5
Hi Captainapache The rules can be a bit confusing. Some units can be choosen as elite. So if you build a two-man crew you can just pick 2 of those units. As for more units in a two-man crew. Yes you can take space dogs etc., but those can't use the Hero types, which you get 2 of. So I don't really see why you would do it. Hope this helps a bit.
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Post by varagon on Apr 2, 2011 11:43:34 GMT -5
sprinting: You expand ALL, not remaining, AP to Sprint.
I don't have the time to do a detailed answer, but look at the Crews as having "slots" while choices (models) fill those slots.
The crew templates give you options. In addition, each model choice, has options as well. The options on the model choices are free just like the options on the Crew templates.
I don't think I explained this well enough, but I'll try to come back later.
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Post by captainapache on Apr 2, 2011 13:32:10 GMT -5
Hi Mobo, thanks for the response and thanks for clearing up that particular part of my query. Appreciated Hi Varagon, Thanks for your response, you've cleared up the sprint rule for me perfectly. I think I was presuming that sprint would be different to just expending all 3 AP and moving 9" during the activation. Thanks. As for the crew question, I understand the options for the model type being free, that bit I get, but I don't get how the crew template option is free. Don't you have to remove a unit or slot?? Just how much can be changed in the crew template options? I'm getting confused with slots and units!! I'm feeling like a bit of a knumbskull. I think examples would be the best way for me to grasp it all. I checked out this link; darksondesigns.proboards.com/inde....lay&thread=2609but I'm still confused.
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Post by TrueRonin on Apr 2, 2011 13:56:01 GMT -5
I can't be very specific about AE: Bounty as I don't have the rulebook, but the way you select units is the same as in AE: WWII, in theory atleast. First things first, you have to choose a template. This could be a Veteran or a Two-man crew template for example. Each crew template holds a number of "training level" choices in it. These could then be, 1 Elite, 2 Veteran and 4 Regular. The next part I guess is the tricky one because I assume this is where WWII and Bounty differ, so I'd rather not guess about it. Someone else has to cover that part. But you basically have to fill these up with units of models or individuals and give them gear to fit the intended role of your crew. In WWII this means you have to look up what choices fit into each category, and this I guess is also true in Bounty in one way or another. Each unit also has specific upgrade possibilities as well, so that a unit might fit into more than one training level. Do I make any sense or am I missing the mark entirely here...? Bear in mind I may be entirely wrong too...
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Post by captainapache on Apr 2, 2011 14:39:54 GMT -5
Hi Trueronin, thanks for your input and help, Training lvls in AE WW2 I guess correspond to Experience lvls in AE Bounty. The problem has arisen for me once I looked at the Two Man Crew. In the rules it states for a TMC ; "Players have the option of removing one unit selection and exchange it for the following; another unit of lower experience level, an additional Dirty Trick, an additional Hero choice, or upgrade an existing unit's Experience Level by one." From this it seems to mean that if I wanted an extra dirty trick for example, I would lose one of my units, which doesn't seem right to me, unless it means I just lose one experience lvl (a slot??), demote one elite unit down to a vet and then use it to gain a new dirty trick. Is this correct, should "unit" or "slot" really read EP (experience Point)? I'm still not sure. Trueronin I think your mention of Training Levels has maybe helped me in the right direction but I need full clarification. Thanks again for your time. "Do I make any sense or am I missing the mark entirely here...? Bear in mind I may be entirely wrong too." No way, all suggestions are valuable!
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Post by TrueRonin on Apr 2, 2011 15:38:57 GMT -5
Well, if you want to make use of the remove a unit option, you sacrifice a whole slot for something else. Eg. I could sacrifice a regular selection to upgrade another regular slot to a veteran. Or I could upgrade an extra individual to become a hero etc. But you lose the unit slot all together by doing so.
Don't worry, it is a balanced tradeoff in most circumstances though, as you'll see once you get to playing a few games. Dirty Tricks or for WWII Special Orders, can be potential game winners if played correctly at the right time, or they might just turn a game around for you that you were sure to lose two minutes earlier.
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Post by varagon on Apr 2, 2011 15:48:31 GMT -5
Exactly. You're two man crew, if you give up a slot, will be a Two Man crew template with one man.
It would be a pretty mean bounty hunter in this case. A model to be feared on the battlefield as he'd get a ton of options.
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Post by captainapache on Apr 2, 2011 17:20:32 GMT -5
Thanks for all your help! I think I may have it at last. Let me run this by you to see if I'm on the right track;
Two Man Crew, with the "Crew Template" options I could do one of the following;
1.) Reduce one elite unit down to a veteran, so I'm left with one elite and one vet.
2.) Lose a slot (so I lose a unit) and add an extra dirty trick so I'm left with one elite with 4 dirty tricks.
3.) The extra hero choice wouldn't apply as both slots can be heros anyway? But if I did use the hero option I would lose a unit/slot/figure(s).
4.) Upgrading an existing unit wouldn't apply either as the unit can't get higher than elite, though for arguments sake, if I did increase to a higher EL I would be left with a one man crew because I've lost a unit to do this? Correct?
How many times are you allowed to lose a unit to carry these options out? If I was using a larger crew could I do it more than once?
Hope I'm getting it now. Look forward to your response(s).
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Post by ibasse on Apr 2, 2011 17:34:28 GMT -5
The Two-Man crew is sort of a bad example as it's probably the one template you don't want to mess with. Any change you make is unlikely to improve upon it, you are however correct in all your assumptions.
You can only sacrifice one crew slot to do one of the things you mentioned. You can't sacrifice 2 slots and upgrade one slot to a higher experience and promote one extra individual to a hero - only one of those can be done.
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Post by TrueRonin on Apr 2, 2011 18:14:33 GMT -5
As ibasse already said, you can only do it so many times... Every crew template should have a limit specified, as to how many times you're allowed to do it.
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Post by abbysdad on Apr 2, 2011 22:06:30 GMT -5
Hi Captain Apache, Welcome to the forum! Here are a couple of replies to your questions. Cheers, Chris Thanks for all your help! I think I may have it at last. Let me run this by you to see if I'm on the right track; Two Man Crew, with the "Crew Template" options I could do one of the following; 1.) Reduce one elite unit down to a veteran, so I'm left with one elite and one vet. Correct. Correct. Not quite. You get two free hero selections for individuals with that option. So, if I have a Merc Sergeant and a Merc Specialist, both can be heroes. At the moment, only individuals can be upgraded to heroes, so, if in your two man crew you chose a squad of Old Guard and a Sergeant, only the Sergeant could be a hero, and the second hero slot would be empty. Correct. For the two-man crew, you may sacrifice a slot for an additional option only once (page 29, Two-Man Crew description, Options paragraph). The number of times you are allowed to make a sacrifice is always listed in the options allowed for the crew template. In the Core book, all of the crew templates allow for only one sacrifice. Keep on asking questions if you have them! And feel free to suggest clearer wording if something in the book is problematic for you.
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Post by captainapache on Apr 3, 2011 7:24:16 GMT -5
Thanks to all for your responses I think the confusion for me was that I hadn't grasped that it's the slot that changes. Because I'm a visually orientated person I tend to understand things better if I can see them, rather than imagine in my head, so for me the crew building process would have been better explained in the rules if there had been a diagram that showed the slots and the changes that could be made, I also like to see multiple examples to illustrate the rule to ram home the point - but that's just me So, here's another question; A Two Man Crew, is it possible to put a Reg unit into it? My answer to that, with my new found and now seemingly blindingly obvious understanding of the rules, is that I would downgrade the Elite slot to Veteran (from the Crew Template options) and pop in a relevant Reg unit that has the free option on it's profile to increase it's EL to Veteran. Is this allowed and do I have it correct? Thanks again.
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Post by TrueRonin on Apr 3, 2011 7:26:46 GMT -5
Yes, that sounds right. Not that it would make much sense doing so though.
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Post by captainapache on Apr 3, 2011 7:57:10 GMT -5
"Not that it would make much sense doing so though." You are right but I'm just trying to see what's possible and test whether I have the rules correct now. I think I've cracked it, I was blind but now I see!! Seems so simple now - like my brain. Thanks to all for your responses. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions.....
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