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Post by malika on Jul 30, 2005 13:37:41 GMT -5
Okay this is something that popped up in my head while on the plane back to Holland. The idea formed after reading some stuff by Noam Chomsky but also other things.
First of all I dont think that the game shouldnt include a clear "good guy vs bad guy" concept, it should make everybody the good and bad guy at the same time, which was the great thing about the South American front. In the past the US supported Nazi warcriminals in order to secure their influence in the region. Hence we could perhaps reflect this.
Let me explain, the US tries to create an "empire" (more something like satellite states similar to post WWII USSR) in Latin America and have several puppet governments in the region. The Nazis would have something similar (Argentina and Brazil mainly). Then there would be some countries who try to do their own thing (be neutral/independent) which causes the US to attack these countries and install military regimes and from time to time support Nazi regimes in the region.
My main plan was that Argentina, Brazil and Venezuela would be the pro Nazi regimes in the region. The US would support Venezuela from time to time because of the large amounts of oil the country has, furthermore they would recruit Nazi agents from Argentina to deploy in the rest of the continent.
The Allied countries would be Colombia, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia and Chile. All of these states except Bolivia would have pro US military and undemocratic regimes in power while Bolivia has a leftist government in power which receives some sort of Soviet support.
Which leads us to that the US could fight against the pro Nazi countries, but also against Bolivia. The Nazis could fight the allied countries but also part of Venezuela which include US companies. So it would be Allies against Nazis while the US from time to time support the Nazis.
Am I getting ahead of myself?
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Post by LibrarianBrent on Jul 30, 2005 16:30:41 GMT -5
The US would not support grabs for territory by countries that were currently at war with them. That makes no sense at all.
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Post by jonasholjer on Jul 31, 2005 2:58:13 GMT -5
I agree, this does not make any sense.
Why would Brazil join the Axis when they fought as an allied nation in the real WW2?
Also, the "no clear good guys or bad guys" is a rather risky path to tread in this context.
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Post by malika on Jul 31, 2005 5:41:37 GMT -5
The US would not support grabs for territory by countries that were currently at war with them. That makes no sense at all. The US supported Nazi agents and warcriminals and recruited them to train military and interrogation units in Latin America in the past. Perhaps a pro Nazi coup took over power in Brazil, I liked the idea of a pro Axis Brazil probably because of that movie Boys In Brazil, perhaps it would be more fitting to take Paraguay? Why? Because the idea that the Allies might be just as bad as the Axis or Soviet Union is a scary idea?
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Post by LibrarianBrent on Jul 31, 2005 12:29:07 GMT -5
Because in general, nations that a country is AT WAR WITH do not trade with them for oil, no matter how much "support" they give! Oil is considered an important wartime resource and is valuable enough to a country with a full wartime footing (especially one such as Germany with its high amounts of tanks and aircraft) that it's sometimes not even traded to ALLIED countries, much less enemies!
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Post by malika on Jul 31, 2005 12:34:37 GMT -5
Okay we will remove the oiltrade then, but still the usage of the enemy to take out figures who might endanger the US influence in the hemisphere. Recruiting Nazis, smuggling captured warcriminals out of Europe and let them train death squadrons in Latin American countries, those kind of operations. Besides I wanted Venezuela to be a sympathetic nation towards the Axis forces, however they would not be an actual Axis nation, sort of neutral but a bit closer to Axis.
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Post by malika on Aug 1, 2005 11:19:18 GMT -5
Okay Brazil was allied, Chile however sided with the Axis until 1944...we could twitch this a bit, let Chile remain loyal to the Axis forces throughout the war.
Let Peru and Ecuador fight amongst themselves, perhaps both the US and nazis would try to keep that conflict go on in order to prevent them from siding with the enemy.
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Post by LibrarianBrent on Aug 1, 2005 13:30:04 GMT -5
Was there another post here that I missed?
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Post by malika on Aug 1, 2005 14:09:06 GMT -5
no...sorry for the double post
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Post by malika on Jan 12, 2006 15:59:18 GMT -5
Hmm idea...alter this conflict. Turned into a more Cold War like conflict. The Germans would have a very powerful base in Argentina, a very loyal pro Axis government however resistance from the people in growing in the form of a socialist resistance movement.
Chile would be neutral/Axis in a similar way as Spain was during WWII. So officially they would be neutral, but they would still hand in logistical support to the Axis forces in the area.
Most of the other countries would have either semi independent government or US puppet regimes. The Soviets dont have any real foothold in the continent, however they do support various organisations such as guerilla movements and political parties.
Pro Axis regimes would fight against the pro US regimes and pro USSR rebels. The US would openly fight against the pro Axis regimes and either indirectly or in a more unconventional sense fight against those nations which regimes are not loyal to Washington.
The USSR supported faction would mainly fight against the pro Axis regimes, but also try to get control of the neutral nations.
This all gives us space for large conventional war. So armies of these countries would mostly fight themselves with support from the superpowers (Germany, US, USSR..perhaps Japan too, would be fitting for Peru). This support would come in the form of training and equipment. However on more rare occassion the superpowers would send in units and officers. I can imagine for example several elite German units being sent to Argentina from where they would attack Brazil for example. Same could be said that the US would send in advisors to help on the defense. US officers would decide which Brazilian units would be send to Europe to support the US.
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Post by recon63 on Jan 13, 2006 10:23:25 GMT -5
interestin idea , but would that make the Falklands islands (british owned and governed) virtually a vital piece of realstate for the Allies to protect, and to launch raids from, and Axis to increase their dominion over the Latin States ?
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Post by malika on Jan 13, 2006 13:17:33 GMT -5
Well I think the US would mainly be in Brazil and Central America.
The British would be on the Falklands, however the Germans immediatly launch an attack there, so heavy naval fighting.
The Japanese try to get a foothold in Peru. Remember that Peru has a large number of Japanese and Chinese immigrants, so it might be interesting that Japan has chemical guerrilas there.
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Post by tordenskjold on Jan 14, 2006 8:01:59 GMT -5
In a former post about the subject I proposed the idea of Che Guevara and Castro as special characters. Malika pointed out that Castro were a teenager and Che not even born at the time of the war, but I am sure we could "fix" that with an alternative time line, or just make our own south American "heroes".
Also, I would love to have some corrupt, ego-centered American ambassadors and/or generals stationed in the allied countrys, to make even more of a mess.
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Post by malika on Jan 14, 2006 9:11:03 GMT -5
Castro and Guevara were both teenagers during WWII, however we could of course have characters which resemble them.
Remember that there have been many leftist figures in Latin American history, only to be kicked out by the US to protect the interests of United Fruit.
Central America could be filled with pro US dictators who follow very brutal doctrines only to make sure that the economic interests of US companies are protected. This was the so called "everybody is a good and bad guy" aspect I mentioned in the past. The US would have a desire to liberate Europe or other parts of the world from the Axis forces while at the same time follow its own agenda of imperialism.
However, some variation would be nice...Im not that familiar with Brazilian history, but perhaps a democratically elected government who is popular with the population would be nice to see.
I could see Marxist rebels operating not only in the pro Axis, but also in the pro US and neutral countries. Of course with SECRET funding and training from the USSR.
It has to be very important that the super powers are involved INDIRECTLY, it will not be a massed battle between US and German troops, it would be more local forces fighting each other supported by the superpowers.
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Post by recon63 on Jan 18, 2006 3:41:19 GMT -5
what about the Germans trying to find a way to use aztec/mayan artifacts and temples and use those associated beliefs/religions of controling the local populace. i believe something like that would be very had for the Allies to counter.
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